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Strange Times?

Tucson, Arizona
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for Dusseldorf
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Strange Times?

Confusion reigns? Closed, the folks that guard it furloughed, but surely Stovepipe and PSR are open. The sense of being got up and left. Where is this country heading? Keep DVNP open and close Las Vegas. Save power and pollution.

ZB

LA
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1. Re: Strange Times?

zabrinski- Your mistake is trying to apply logic to this situation.

Tucson, Arizona
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for Dusseldorf
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2. Re: Strange Times?

Logical is surely not I sir. I am looking out over Lake Michigan this morning and it appears open. On a clear day you can almost see to Canada. Travel to Vegas drive to DV and it seems the same. How about a sign.

ZB

Edited: 11:33 am, October 01, 2013
Camp Sherman, Oregon
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3. Re: Strange Times?

Here's some information a poster on DVTalk past along from National Parks Traveler:

"At Death Valley National Park in California and Nevada, California 190 would remain open across the park, as would the road to Scotty's Castle, as it's a through-road in the park. But most other roads and park facilities would be closed, said Abby Wines, the park's acting public information officer.

The Furnace Creek Ranch and Furnace Creek Inn both would remain open, as they sit on private property, as does the Panamint Springs Resort, she said. The facilities at Stovepipe Wells are owned by the Park Service, and so would be closed in the event of a government shutdown, said Ms. Wines."

So along with many of the backcountry type places closed due to road wash outs really not much to do in DV right now but golf and swim! With our recent record winds and rains up here that sounds pretty good!

I wonder too if Badwater Rd. will be open, as I believe it is a state pass through highway(178?) or I believe it becomes a DVNP road once it enters the park from the south, though it is closed south of Badwater anyway too.

Was still somewhat planning a last week of October tent trip but with all this and most of the areas I want to visit closed due to wash outs most likley not going to happen.

Camp Sherman, Oregon
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4. Re: Strange Times?

Zabriskie,

Here's more info, a bit of confusion from various sources but from the DV Facebook page:

Government Shutdown Update:

All roads other than Hwy 190 will be shutdown for an indefinite amount of time. Barricades will be in effect at the intersections of Hwy190 and the Badwater and Scotty's Castle roads. The gas pumps will not be working at Stovepipe Well, but all other facilities at SPW, FCR, and PSR will be open. The Death Valley Road Conditions and Death Valley National Park pages will also not be active. Sorry for the inconvenience. (dk)

and then "Correction: Scotty's Castle/Bonnie Claire Road will be open as it is a major through route (dk)"

So I guess you can't drive in from Beatty? Frisco? Too bad as Beatty could get more business from the 49er's encampment who would normally camp in the campgrounds and back country. PSR, SPW and FCR will all be full I'm sure.

I would probably be one of those who would chance it and camp somewhere, say Echo Canyon or Hole in the Wall areas. Close and safe and perhaps those enforcing the shutdown wouldn't check there.

As Facebook is the "host" on that page it is still up though no one will be updating until things are solved unless an employee logs into Facebook from home. That would be nice to here more from the people there.

Edited: 8:56 pm, October 01, 2013
San Francisco
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for Death Valley Junction, Death Valley National Park
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5. Re: Strange Times?

Stovepipe Wells is NPS property. The Death Valley Lodging Co. is the concessioner, meaning it runs the facility by contract with the NPS. So it would seem odd for it to stay open, since the DOI directive is that facilities run by concessioners would have to be vacated. What Abby Wines said makes much more sense.

Furnace Creek and Panamint Springs are inholdings, IOW private properties surrounded by park lands. Neither of them was ever NPS land; they were privately owned when Death Valley was brought into the park system and have always remained private. (Furnace Creek originally belonged to the Pacific Coast Borax Co. and was sold to Fred Harvey, the corporate ancestor of hotel operators AmFac and Xanterra. Panamint Springs was just outside the former National Monument, and was included in the 1993 enlarged Park boundary).

I was speculating on another thread (in the Yosemite forum IIRC) that the Feds couldn't kick anyone out of the inholdings as long as they stayed there or on CA 190 and didn't trespass onto the lands that actually belong to us working, taxpaying Americans, like Zabriskie Point or Badwater.

The roads from Beatty and Scotty’s Junction are NV state highways until the park boundary. When they cross over the boundary, they are no longer state but park roads (different from the situation with Hwy 190, which is a state road all the way through the park). So I guess the park could close either the 267 or 374 entrances. Why they might choose to close 374 rather than 267 is a mystery, because from all I’ve seen, the Beatty entrance is much, much busier. It, not 266, is the major through route. There are no services at Scotty’s Junction and few people enter the park there compared with 374. If it were my call and I could keep only one road open, and I wanted the lightest impact on the fewest travelers, and on local businesses, I personally would keep the road open from Beatty.

My understanding is that Badwater Road is not Hwy 178. There are a few state highways in California that break off and resume elsewhere. Hwy 178 stops at Trona and picks up outside the DVNP boundary. The others that come to mind break off over the Sierra Nevada and resume on the other side. Hwy 190 goes west from DV end ends at Olancha on 395. Then it has a section that goes from Porterville into Sequoia National Forest (not Park). Another is Hwy 168; it starts at the NV line as an extension of NV 266 (and goes to the Ancient Bristlecone Pine Forest turnoff). At Big Pine it follows the same path as Hwy 395 to Bishop, then goes west into the mountains to the Sabrina Lake area where it stops. On the west side of the Sierra it goes from Fresno to Huntington Lake.

There may be others, but I can’t think of any now. I wonder if 190 and 168 were once contemplated as trans-Sierra roads, before the state concluded that the terrain, cost, probable light usage, short user season (much higher elevations than Tioga Pass), and overall ROI made that a dumb idea. Honestly, all it takes is a common road map to see there’s no way you could build a road from Lone Pine to Porterville or Bishop to Fresno and make the investment worthwhile. Not to mention the ruinous impact on some of the most pristine and beautiful wilderness in America.

6. Re: Strange Times?

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